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Redesign of the Wiki Main Page
Wosh Sat Dec 08, 2007 New Wiki Main Page
I have created a new wiki main page proposal for the following purposes:
1. Short overview about Puppy Linux.
2. Clear and understandable design.
3. Concentration on the main features of Puppy Linux and this wiki.
4. A language that is understood by beginners.
5. Easy navigation by structuring the topics.
I hope you like it and I can't wait your replies.
LoF Sat Dec 08, 2007
There is a main page idea that I tried over at LoFSandBox
My ideas are:
- RSS/ Live news feed from Barry's Blog, Wiki latest News or equivalent. (RSS problems within wikka are stopping this though)
- Featured pages, images, news, etc... in the style of Wikipedia Home
- Nice big official-looking download link.
- Big links to top places (forum, blog, official home, etc) - see blue icon bar on my mainpage idea (BTW they're my own icons so feel free to use them wherever)
Problems with my idea: I'm working at a 1280x1024 screen res. Thus not very good for lots of others.
Wosh Sat Dec 08, 2007 Re: LoFSandBox
Hi LoF
My opinion about your design:
1. The page is to long.
2. The topics/links are not structured.
3. The topics/links are not explained.
4. The page is a rather random selection of pages of this wiki.
5. There are to many topics that belong to a lower level but not on the main page.
In my a opinion the main page is the advertisment for Puppy Linux. It should give a short introduction about Puppy Linux and lead the user to the searched information in a structured way. It should not divert and it should not confuse by to many different topics. Especially people that have no special knowledge about Puppy Linux should find information in a way and language that is easy to understand. What I am thinking of, is giving the wiki a clear information structure like a directory tree with the main page as root directory.
So please remember: The wiki especially should give information for people that don't know much about Puppy Linux yet.
Wosh Sun Dec 09, 2007 Re: Headline Deletion
Hi CrustyLobster
Why shouldn't we make a preselection of the menu items by headlines in this or another form to make it more easy for beginners to know what's going on:
1. Latest versions
2. Properties of Puppy Linux
3. Community
4. Around Puppy Linux
LoF Sat Dec 08, 2007 Re: LoFSandBox
Hi Wosh (and everyone else)
Thanks for your input, I agree with you that the menu box thing on the right is a bit crowded (it is borrowed from KluNine's mainpage idea, KluNineMainPage). I should point out though that my sandbox is not exclusively a main page concept, as the whole page is a work in progress. My idea for a main page ends at the word end and the 3 line breaks. Sorry if that was not clear enough.
Also I'm going to have to disagree with you on the main purpose of this page. I feel that the wiki should not aim to be an advertisement but a portal to the wealth of information available to Puppy Linux users (newbie or not). Thus it should be clear but targetted, not just to those happening upon Puppy but also to those of us who just need information and resources. Obviously it needs to accomodate for someone who knows little or nothing about Puppy Linux. A nice big link to an introductory page could do this.
Still think RSS would be awesome though. Any coders want to input about that?
KluNine Sun 09-Dec-2007
LoF wrote: I feel that the wiki should not aim to be an advertisement but a portal to the wealth of information available to Puppy Linux users (newbie or not).
Couldn't it be both? That's one of the goals of my redesign: to offer a pretty comprehensive selection of important links, but divided into categories so users, whether new to puppy or not, can easily scan and pick just what interests them. The info most relevant for new users near the top to get their attention first, but still has access to things for users already in Puppy.
It's ugly, but in the forum thread on this issue∞ headfound suggested CSS could fix the appearance. I found this CSS link∞ that demonstrates how the same information can be presented with vastly different appearances by changing the CSS. So maybe we could focus on the info to present and let CSS take care of the looks.
And maybe we should continue the discussion there in the forum; then I won't have to type my name, date, horizontal rulers etc :-D
Wosh Sun Dec 09, 2007 Reasons for the Discussion on the Wiki
Hi KluNine
I agree with you that a discussion normally should be lead in the forum (see: CategoryWikiDiscussion). But I started the discussion here for the following reasons:
1. I want a platform for the people contributing serial proposals to this wiki on the wiki.
2. I want the impressions of every kind of people (registered/ unregistered, beginners, pros) without the detour to the forum.
3. I want to make it easy for everyone to post a statement (everybody can at least add a comment).
So I beg your pardon about your inconveniencies. ;-)
About your proposal:
I think it points to the right direction presenting the information of this wiki in a structured way even if it looks a little spartan.
Maybe we could combine the current three proposals to one combining the strength of each of them.
1. Offer the information in a structured way like in your proposal.
2. Add hints to the items/topics/links like in my proposal.
3. Add pictures/icons like in LoF's proposal.
About your remark with the categories:
I have made great efforts in recategorizing the wiki as you see in CategoryCategory but I am not content yet. But this is another discussion topic ReorganisationOfTheWikiStructure.
About the CSS link:
In my opinion the examples shown there are nice, but in a wiki this kind of presentation distracts from the information offered.
KluNine 10-Dec-2007
Hi Wosh,
Re discussing this in the wiki itself
I see your point about accessibility.
Re the look/photos & icons/layout~structure/CSS
my redesign looks spartan; those examples at the CSS Zen garden are over the top. But the point is that the look, layout, pictures etc (whether spartan or complex or somewhere in between) can be handled by a CSS file, while we users just concentrate on what information to put on the page.
The CSS could be as simple as just putting the information in 2 columns and adding a picture or two.
LoF Dec 10, 2007
Hi all
Just to put in my opinion on the CSS debate. I suggest we don't use css. Mainly because it goes away from the point and style of the wiki concept. The css would not be easily editable and so could not be truely open.
Maybe we should compile a list of things we want to see. (say at the top of this page?) I'll stick by my big clear obvious links with lots of pictures and dynamic content. (Ah! I sound ridiculously web 2.0)
Also on a sidenote. Are we going to leave each others responses in this discussion untouched no matter what? It's just "JoF" and "spartanic" confuse me. No offence meant. I'm all for leaving them for prosperity though; transparency and all that.
Wosh Mon Dec 10, 2007 Re: Mistakes, CSS and Pages
Hi all
Sorry about my mistakes I am not native Engish speaking so sometimes I use a wrong expression, I've corrected them myself. And sometimes I write without intensive reading afterwards. But LoF's clock also runs backward. :-)
I don't know enough about the possibilities of CSS to judge it. So if KluNine could create an useful example for the wiki we would know more.
I have taken a closer look to LoF's page proposal and at the second view I found some good ideas and concepts like the featured page/screenshot that should be changed regularly. So eventually it's the order that makes it confusing to me. It's also the latest news that take up to much space compared to use they provide. Please LoF create a main page with only the topics you want to expose on it and call it i.e. LoFMainPage. That's really allowed. ;-)
If you after that think of the structure and put the main topics to the left and also think of the beginners and put some explanations beside the links my impression will become even better.
For me the main topic is still to improve the structure of the wiki, because in my opinion the main page is only the mirror of this structure.
So let's improve our proposals, because at the moment we talk to much and create to little.
LoF Dec 11, 2007
Ahh! Forgot to change dates! See this is why I like dynamic content? Lol. Note to self: don't just copy and paste.
I agree with you Wosh. And... just for you... LoFMainPage.
KluNine, 16-Dec-2007
CSS & editability
The CSS might or might not be easily editable by someone without experience, but the data/the info would still be easily editable by anyone; maybe even more easily as most of the formatting will be divorced from the wiki page. That's the point (AFAIK) of CSS: to divorce appearance from data.
When someone wanted to edit the page, there would a link to a CSS file at the top, and then all the info as usual, editable as usual, with wiki coding as usual.
CSS experimenting
I've never done anything with CSS. I've looked into it a little, and it would require the admin of this wiki to allow it. See http://wikkawiki.org/CustomCSS∞
The actual coding doesn't seem too opaque either, if an expert creates it & someone else just want to do some tweaking; the codes are things like colour, background-color, font etc. See http://www.w3.org/Style/Examples/011/firstcss∞
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